Thursday, June 17, 2010

Surname, Widing. Looking for Widing Legends: The Warrior, the Beast, and the King

The Widinga Saga - Ersatz
The Wild Hunt Idea


1.  The place of nicknames in a culture.

Look into Viking culture and find Nicknames.  Names bestowed as an honor; or as a joke.  Nicknames in Norse culture.

Naming is a cultural matter.  Northmen:
"Many Vikings also had a nickname which was used instead of their family name. Giving a nickname was like naming a newborn baby; it created a special tie between the name-giver and name-taker. The newly named person could claim a gift from the name-giver, either a present or a favour, even if the name was derogatory, which many of them were."
That from ://

2.  Families pass on stories and about who they are, how they were named, or were, or wish(ed) to be.

Look for the roots, corroboration.  For example, where, if anywhere, is there a young man in the woods who saves the King on a hunt, from the charging Bear, and given an honorary name, Widing (sounds far to modern and ordinary to have ancient roots) or whatever its ancient derivation.

No luck?  Here is one vaguely like it, but about a Bull instead;  from the Ynglinga Saga, section 30, Of Egil and Tunne, at :// fair use quote.  The King does not live long, however, and it is not just one of his men who saves him, but a group:

It happened in Sweden that an old bull, which was destined for sacrifice, was fed so high that he became dangerous to people; and when they were going to lay hold of him he escaped into the woods, became furious, and was long in the forest committing great damage to the country.  King Egil was a great hunter, and often rode into the forest to chase wild animals.  Once he rode out with his men to hunt in the forest.  The king had traced an animal a long while, and followed it in the forest, separated from all his men.  He observed at last that it was the bull, and rode up to it to kill it.  The bull turned round suddenly, and the king struck him with his spear; but it tore itself out of the wound.  The bull now struck his horn in the side of the horse, so that he instantly fell flat on the earth with the king.  The king sprang up, and was drawing his sword, when the bull struck his horns right into the king's breast.  The king's men then came up and killed the bull.  The king lived but a short time, and was buried in a mound at Upsal. 
This is a site that mixes the old poem with summary narrative sections. 

3.  Stories with nicknames.

See the New Northvegr Center for northern pre-Christian history and stories, at ://  Reading it now.

4.  The Wild Hunt.

Wild, wide, Widing.  That is a stretch, because names and pronunciations change, but the idea is fun -- ghost riders in the sky stemming from Norse mythology. Johnny Cash, your source.  Hear and see ://

This is a common idea, theme, fierce in the night, horses' hooves flashing sparks, see ://  Wild rides with ghosts and hounds and weather to keep good folks inside.

Norse follow the wild ride pattern, see ://  See the Gandreich  in Njal's Saga --  CXXV is cited  -- the Furious Host appears.  Scroll down for it at the Wild Hunt site.

The Norse Odin, the Germanic Wodan, Widing?  Oh, stretch on. See ://

5.  This sounds close in concept: But is this all we can find?

We get back to Custom in this regard.  That the retinue is rewarded by the Hunter. In our case, was the reward a name that referred to the king, not just a bearskin.

"Those who help the Hunter or members of his train, however, are often rewarded with gifts."

Widing in Runes. Swedish surname Widing. Roots in Runes, Legend, or Fantasy. Probably fantasy.

 Gather 'Round

It is Thanksgiving, every single, solitary year.  And our older family members are yet again recounting the old family story of the Widings, that there was a young brave fellow out hunting in the King's party (not royalty for our fellow).

The King was attacked by a Bear and nearly killed, but our ever-handsomer fellow saved the King. And was rewarded by the King with the name Widing. "You shall have the name, Widing!" And so it was.  And they multiplied. OMG, did they multiply.

Who might the King have been?  Jump ahead - why not King Inge ; or King Widukind?

Many questions.  Not only the identity of the King, but what does that bestowed name of Widing mean.  So we parse out its elements into VID or WID and ING and see what we get.

First we have to learn the alphabets and runes, and here are our Ten Points and whatever we conclude at #10.  Linguistics: terms to look up in evolution of Swedish language, in family of North Germanic languages. Find these at ://

Ten Points to a Surname

Start with Runes.  These are magical, not just letter forms, or sound forms, and in combination, can wield sorcery, or charms, so it was said. See ://

Here is our version of Widing, surname, in Elder Futhark, runes given below.  Note that there are two ways to do the N G -- as separate forms;
  • first, looking like a Plus with a bad night, crossbar tilted down; or an X; and then 
  • second, as a single sound NG, made with a form like an even-sided diamond.  
  • temporarily removed while we fix it.  Forgot a stick.


1. Ancient Nordic.
Also called Proto-Norse:  1st-8th Centuries ACE.
Very ancient.
Writing system:
Elder Futhark (who were the Futharks?)
Ah. Futhark means only the first six letters or Runes.
See them here - F U TH A R K
See ://

 Note the combined NG form, the diamond shape.  That combined NG is called the "ingwaz", see section 6 here.

Counting the runes;  naming them by number.

Example: In Elder Futhark, the ng is that equal sided diamond, top apex to right and left points; and bottom apex.

This is also called Rune 22, the Ingwaz, see ://

It is the "sixth rune of the third aett". Look back up there. Yes!  Count by eights.  Go to the third group of "eight" and count to the sixth rune in that third "eight."  There it is. The ingwaz is Rune 22 counting over by ones.

Widing then would be, if the system is easy, with the ingwaz at the end:

 And if the N and G are separate, Widing might look like this:

 No ingwaz in that form.


2.  Old Norse - West, East, and Old Gutnish

This is the Viking Ages language, about 700-1300 AD.
Not so ancient.
Old West Norse: this was the dialect of Iceland and Norway.
Old East Norse:  Sweden and Denmark.
Old Gutnish:  On the island of Gotland, east coast of Sweden.
Writing system:
Younger Futhark.

There are two versions: "Short-twig" and Danish, see ://

Fewer letter forms.   There is no W, no D, no G,
No way for us to write Widing in Younger Futhark so far.

 WIDING In Younger Futhark, Old Norse Viking age,

  • w - we see no W, but there is a fv - stick with two parallel stick arms from midpoint raised to right, like branches

Is that like a pictogram, a tree-form?

  • i - no separate I, but there is ie - a plain stick
  • d - no separate d, but there is td - a stick arrow with the pointing v at the top; or, there is th dh - a stick with a pointy Santa Claus belly-V on the right side - not quite to full stick length
  • i - same plain stick as ie
  • ng - not here.  The Ingwaz did not carry over for the Norse by that time.
  • But here is the interesting part.  The NG appears in old Anglo Saxon as ING.  See Saxon connections in linguistics and Norse at Saxon Widing Roots. See ://  
  •  For the Danes, Ing seems to have been a person, who now is buried in Uppsala; or in the alternative, his boat bearing his dead body sank off somewhere, as intended.*
n - stick with midpoint line across then tipped from upper right to lower left
g - there is kg like the fv, but with only the lower, longer branch reaching up




3.  Old Swedish

Boring.  Our alphabet.
Old Swedish evolved from Old East Norse.
13th-16th Centuries ACE
Writing system:  Latin alphabet. ABC.

WIDING,  we suppose.


4.  Modern Swedish:

Sweden, and parts of Finland. Say 9.3 million speakers.

More Widing.  



7.  Neither element of WID or ING are listed at ://; and nothing like that in the V's either.
But, in the listing of mythological-related names, there is what looks like Vidarr, Old Norse male name. And Vidr appears in Old Norse as forest wood or tree, see :// or  Viper (?) is forest, wood, or tree (see ://  Widu in ancient Germanic is "forest as a borderline" and the name element of VID, with somewhat different symbols, a small line through the upright stick of the D, and an angled I with a little widgy on top, like a little flag, gets us to a page still under construction

8.  More on "wid"

From WIDO, Ancient Germanic. "Originally a short form of names beginning with the Germanic element widu "wood" or wid 'wide' ". See  See also wid or wido meaning wide at ://

Then - we see WIDO meaning "Warrior Maiden".  Yes.  See://


So we need more on the VID name element.

8.  The NG or ING name element:
*Continued from above.  See Ing as a being, a god, Ingvi Freyr, a "deity with solar aspects" - fertility,  a god of peace, plenty, often shown erect, but also a warrior, :// (here, Ingwaz site). Luck, protection, good times, husband, father, hearth, home, and happy surprises. Also inspiration, mysticism, life, health. And force to ward stuff off. Reinstill will to live.

Need to look up the Ynglingasaga.

9.  The Old Swedish Royal Family had the surname Ynglingar, see the Ingwaz site. Ingvi Freyr was an ancestor.  Do we have all this right? 

10.  All fun, but out of this, can we find a brave Proto-Norse or later fellow who fought the bear (Berserker?) and saved the king, and was rewarded with the name Wid-Ing? Of course we can. Because we want to.  Heroes in the line.  Yes. Here a paunch, there an ear-piece, perhaps someone falling asleep, but heroes all.

Wednesday, June 16, 2010


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